Any tips for shopping for old cars?

"WilliamsSW" (williamssw) 03/26/2019 at 17:25 • Filed to: OLDCARLOPNIK

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I’m not saying that I’m doing that, but I’m not not saying it, either, OK? What obvious things am I missing from my rough list below? Keep in mind that I’d be looking at driver quality cars that are 50+ years old - and I have a strong preference for as much originality as possible, but I’m not looking at the sort of car that anyone would create a ‘fake’ of.

My kind of rough checklist includes:

- making sure I know how to ID appropriate engine (and trans if needed) castings in advance. I’m not looking for matching numbers, but most manufacturers made many different V8s that essentially look the same. You could easily be looking at a ‘60s Catalina that the seller says (and believes) has a 389, but it’s actually a 350, 400, or 455 that was swapped in 6 owners and 32 years ago. You won’t notice unless you find a casting number.

- do a walk around from a distance first, to see how the car sits (corners sagging, obvious misalignments, etc)

- look over body carefully for dents, rust, bondo, accident repairs, paint mismatch, overspray, color changes - and *feel* around the inside of fenders etc looking for rust/bondo

- open and shut hood, trunk, and doors - door misalignments can be a bad sign (or not)

- look carefully around windshield and backlight for signs of rust/water - inside car and trunk, too.

- condition of all trim, including bumpers - pitting, missing etc

- under hood - what engine, accessories are present. Signs of leaks?

- under car - frame condition, signs of recent replacement parts, leaks, accident damage

- trunk - floors replaced/rusty? Does the rear window leak? Signs of accident repair?

- Interior - condition of *everything*, signs of water, is the wear appropriate for the claimed mileage?

- Drive - FIRST - check the brake pedal. Does it feel correct and firm? If not, DO NOT DRIVE. Start - does the engine catch quickly and idle well (high idle if cold)? Again, brake. Shift into gear if auto - does it engage appropriately without too much jerk? Are the brakes holding the car stopped?

Check any accessories as needed.

Once on the road, check brakes, acceler ator pump, shift quality through all gears, clutch if appropriate (top gear low speed acceleration), downshifts, brakes . Brakes, suspension/steering noises etc. More brakes.

I got tired of typing all the detail once I’m in the car and starting it, but you get the picture.

What else??

Tripper > WilliamsSW 03/26/2019 at 17:34

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I can only tell you that it’s a good idea, as I bought mine sight unseen from a far away land.

WilliamsSW > Tripper 03/26/2019 at 17:39

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LOL - with videos and lots of good photos, most questions can be answered long-distance.  And either way, you need to budget to repair a few things once you buy.

ITA97, now with more Jag @ opposite-lock.com > WilliamsSW 03/26/2019 at 17:44

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My biggest tip beyond getting a PPI done on a prospective purchase by a specialty shop or wrench that knows those cars, would be to get to know some folks at the specialty shops/owners groups/forums. When it comes to enthusiast cars, and especially older or more specialized stuff, they have a way of changing hands among folks that already know each other, or at least know of each other through some common intermediary. Not to say you can’t find something great otherwise, but the better cars have a way of never needing to be listed for sale publicly. The lower end cars tend to be the ones that get put up publicly , along the very best of breed that someone wants to get top dollar for via specialty auction house/BAT/ect.  The good cars for reasonable money are the ones that don’t need to be really advertised.

vicali > WilliamsSW 03/26/2019 at 17:46

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Learn the tricks for the models you are looking at;

eg - beetles+ghias; check the heater channels for rust, look at the front and rear aprons to see if they were in a crash. You could easily overlook these two spots and it will change a $1000 project into a $5000 project.

MGB/Triumph; MGB rust in the doorsills and rockers mean the unibody structure is toast. Triumph have a frame so the same rust isn’t a deal breaker.

I walked away from a ghia vert with wiggly heater channels and the wrong tail lights/ bumper/trunk style for the year . . It was sad but the signs pointed to a front clip and a rear clip from two different cars were put together shoddy fashion . D odged a bullet.

promoted by the color red > WilliamsSW 03/26/2019 at 17:47

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Check the condition of the wiring: is it matted and the insulation crumbling? It’s not difficult to fix, but chasing shorts and broken wires is a huge PITA.

Also, flex the underhood hoses. See how many are good and how many are on their way out. 

Tripper > WilliamsSW 03/26/2019 at 17:48

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Ha true. I was only really concerned with rust. I saw videos of it starting and driving so I figured any little things I could fix. I get the car back tomorrow from getting all of those little things fixed to the tune of $2500ish. Not terrible for a 44year old car from Holland.

WilliamsSW > vicali 03/26/2019 at 17:49

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Excellent point - I have actually done that with the Corvair already (Corvair Society of America has awesome support for this) , and probably need to do a bit more on the GM B-bodies that I’m looking at. Truth is, I know a lot of the tricks for those already, but I’m rusty on them (no pun intended) and could use a bit of a refresher.

lone_liberal > WilliamsSW 03/26/2019 at 17:49

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Bring a magnet that won’t scratch paint, like the ones you get from RockAuto. Put it to good use in the rear quarters and other areas prone to rust. 

WilliamsSW > ITA97, now with more Jag @ opposite-lock.com 03/26/2019 at 17:54

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Great points. The cars I’m looking at (60's GM A- and B-bodies) are generally fairly simple, and I’ve done a fair amount of research on them already, and have already owned a handful, but not recently.  I’ve been doing research, but still need to do more.

To some extent, I’m at a point where I need to go and actually *drive* one to see if my memories of the joy of driving one still hold - or if all these years of driving modern cars have just spoiled me to the point where I’ll hate them.

WilliamsSW > lone_liberal 03/26/2019 at 17:57

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Yeah - and I would add around the windshield and backlight, too.  The cars I’m looking at are really prone to holding water and rusting through there, then eventually trashing the trunk and floor pans.

WilliamsSW > promoted by the color red 03/26/2019 at 17:58

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I thought about the hoses (but too lazy to type it out) , but had forgotten about wiring. Great add!

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > WilliamsSW 03/26/2019 at 17:59

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Could just bring a tape measure and measure how the car sits. 

WilliamsSW > Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies 03/26/2019 at 18:01

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One other, maybe more critical use of the tape measure is to measure my garage to see what fits...

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > WilliamsSW 03/26/2019 at 18:12

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That’s what a saw is for. 

factoryhack > WilliamsSW 03/27/2019 at 00:10

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The first thing I would do is make sure you like driving the car. It’s been my experience that 50+ year old cars are generally shockingly bad to drive relative to what we are used to on a modern car. Cars of that vintage, especially big American iron, handle poorly, have vague over boosted steering, and lousy stopping distances with various levels of inappropriate lock up from highway speeds. They are terrible daily drivers with extremely poor accident protection.

Then again, I still love old cars for a lot of nonsensical reasons that have little to do with how they drive. My last one was a B body Mopar which was fun but a royal pain in the rear to keep running properly.

I would also invest in a mil gauge so you can accurately see paint depth as well as a magnet designed for checking body work. Besides the obvious things others have listed, understand the date codes on the tires and spare. Tires aren’t cheap and a lot of classic cars have old, unsafe tires that look good to the casual observer but are definitely not road worthy. Good luck.

WilliamsSW > factoryhack 03/27/2019 at 00:30

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Thanks - I’ve owned these cars in the past, so I’m familiar with them, but it’s been a long time. I’ve owned a 65 Cutlass, 65 Skylark , and 64 Olds 88, as well as a 72 Monte Carlo - and all were DDs.

Tires are certainly on my list of things to check, starting with date codes.

Good idea on the mil gauge, I hadn’t thought about that.

I’m actually going to look at a car tomorrow, in large part to get behind the wheel of an old car again, to see if I still enjoy it.